A regular visitor and reader of IST John at https://johnrieber.com/ (visit often for some wonderful stuff)….in a recent comment he asked what would happen if the generals that were chastised by Hogsbreath and Donny refused an order…..
I found this article that may answer his question.
…
Increasingly, then, the question is: What will the military leaders do? Let Trump turn full blown Kim Jong Un? Or say, “No sir!”
About saying “NO!”… It isn’t just legal — it is compulsory under the current conditions, and this will only become more apparent. According to the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ, Article 92, service members have the duty to obey only lawful orders and to refuse unlawful ones. An order is unlawful if it violates the Constitution, US laws, military regulations, or international law. Obeying illegal orders can result in criminal liability.
At Quantico, by remaining silent, by not applauding, by not smiling at Trump’s “jokes,” the generals and admirals gave some of us at least a sliver of hope that they understand the weighty responsibility upon their shoulders.
Perhaps they will not, after all, go quietly into the night.
This may not be a definitive answer to the question but it could give us an idea an d ask questions of our generals, our military commanders.
If we go by the Uniform Code of Military Justice there are several things that could be levied against one who breaks the code….
Punishments under the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) range from less severe administrative penalties to severe criminal punishments, including reprimands, forfeiture of pay, reduction in rank, extra duties, restriction, confinement, and punitive discharges like a bad-conduct or dishonorable discharge. The specific punishment depends on the severity of the offense, and for the most serious crimes, penalties can include life imprisonment or the death penalty.
- Reprimand:A formal verbal or written disapproval of conduct.
Reduction in rank:Demotion to a lower pay grade.
Forfeiture of pay:A portion of the service member’s pay is withheld.
Extra duties:Being assigned additional duties outside of the normal work schedule.
Restriction:Being confined to a specific geographic area, such as a base.
Confinement:Physical imprisonment, with options for hard labor without confinement.
Fines:Monetary fines can be imposed.
Punitive discharges:These are severe penalties that result in separation from the military and can have significant consequences:
Bad-conduct discharge:Imposed for more serious offenses.Dishonorable discharge:The most severe type of discharge, used for the most serious offenses.Dismissal:The equivalent of a dishonorable discharge for an officer.
Death penalty:Can be imposed for the most extreme offenses, such as treason or espionage.Severity and process
Minor offenses are typically handled by a commanding officer through a process known as Article 15 or non-judicial punishment, which avoids a criminal conviction.
More serious offenses are tried in a court-martial, which is a military trial.
Article 92 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) covers the Failure to Obey an Order or Regulation. Service members accused of failure to obey orders, regulations or performing their duties in a negligent or intentionally poor manner may be charged under this article.
This is one of the most commonly charged offenses in military justice. It can apply to a wide range of misconduct, including dereliction of duty, failure to follow safety protocols, and refusing to carry out a lawful order.
Violating a lawful order in the military is serious. The government may launch an investigation into:
- Refusal to carry out orders
- Negligent performance of duty
- Drunk or incapacitated on duty
- Failure to follow standing safety procedures
- Dereliction of duty that causes injury or death
Even a single mistake can lead to nonjudicial punishment (Article 15), a GOMOR (General Officer Memorandum of Reprimand), administrative separation, or even court-martial.
I know it is a lot of information but this is the jest of what someone who disobeys a direct order can look forward to getting.
Now the question is will any of the generals show that sort of fortitude after in vesting much of their adult life to the military?
I hope this helps understand what is expected if one does not follow a direct order.
I Read, I Write, You Know
“lego ergo scribo”
Whatever the consequences, I really hope they (or some of them) have the guts to say “NO”.
Best wishes, Pete.
We will just have to wait…..I have mixed thoughts…..chuq
They will, in typical american fashion, forget all about honor, duty and country and will do what they are told to save their own asses…If that were not the case there would be no troops on american streets right now.
Read here and from that jerk governor of Illionois that “the gobberment is the emany” that Trump intends to use the army to overturn the next election. What a silly assertion. The entire military would say NO to such an order. Our troops are not the personal Praetorian Guard of a Roman Emperor. They swore allegience to their commanding general (who paid their salary from personalfunds) and not Rome or the emperor. We don’;t do that here either. Our troops are not a military establishment like Prussia. They are citizen soldiers who swear allegience to protect the Constution and from enemies foreign and domestic. They don’t belong to a president. They would say NO and they would win the day.
They will save their own asses , ignore the Constitution, forget all about their oaths and obey the orders of any dictator who can either fire them or courts martial them– you can bet your ass on that.
The military is being used in ways that it was not intended….just how many guts will be found in our command of the military? chuq
There are several limitations to the power granted to the President as Commander-in-Chief, but as most of us know –and have seen — in Trump’s case, all bets are off.
How long will the courts allow this silliness to continue? chuq
I think many of the lower courts are trying … but as we have observed, certain members of the “High Court” see things differently.
And that is why the conservative Federalist Society picks the candidates for the GOP….and so far they have crapped on everything we hold dear….or least we use to…..chuq